The Kendama Forum

Forum categories => Tricks => Topic started by: SamB on 10 September, 2011, 20:42:29

Title: Speed Trick B
Post by: SamB on 10 September, 2011, 20:42:29
I noticed a fair bit of talk on here about the JKA speed trick B:

1. Swing to candle
2. Around the prefecture
3. Around Japan 2 times
4. Around the world 2 times
5. Around Europe
6. Earth turn
7. Bird and in
8. Jumping stick
9. One-turn aeroplane
10. Falling down

I just started practicing and have some questions:

Is "Around Japan 2 times" big -> small -> spike -> big -> small -> spike or do you start from with the ball down after the first around Japan?
Do the bird and lighthouse have to be still and if so for how long?

Obviously more tips, videos, and record times would be awesome

!
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: BKA on 10 September, 2011, 22:03:56
I noticed a fair bit of talk on here about the JKA speed trick B:
Is "Around Japan 2 times" big -> small -> spike -> big -> small -> spike
Yes, although it's traditionally small cup first, then big (but the other way around is allowed).
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or do you start from with the ball down after the first around Japan?
Do the bird and lighthouse have to be still and if so for how long?
No and No Yes, but only for "a moment" - The Bird must be full contact and clear, and the Lighthouse must be vertical.
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Obviously more tips, videos, and record times would be awesome!
Check out how it's really done!
タイム競技B19秒0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aQnBzqb3C0#ws)
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: AlexSmith on 11 September, 2011, 03:05:45
I think I've seen that before... but that is literally the fastest I can imagine anyone doing it ever. It blows my mind every time.
One thing... I'm guessing you don't have to furiken into the earth turn like he does? As anyone who has furikens down well will tell you, a furiken can actually be easier to land than a straight pull up spike, so I'm guessing thats why he does it that way?
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: The Void on 11 September, 2011, 11:25:17
The trick Earth Turn *includes* the swing in, so yes, you do.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: Mark on 21 November, 2011, 20:15:03
My current fastest time of this is 2minutes.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: Dadooh on 02 March, 2012, 04:40:08
I have a very important question about speed trick B and more precisely concerning "around japan 2 times" and "around the world 2 times". For example, if i miss the second around japan, should i do around japan 2 times once again or just the second one?
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: BKA on 02 March, 2012, 11:57:59
You have to do both again.
Think of it as one trick that is "Around Japan two times in a row".
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: Dadooh on 02 March, 2012, 12:19:14
Ok thanks for the precision. It means that i didn't break my record this morning :'(. Ok let's try again!
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: BKA on 24 March, 2012, 22:02:31
YB's been doing his homework:
Why Be Kendama Speed Trick B (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WinRoOrq6qw#ws)
(http://i4.ytimg.com/vi/WinRoOrq6qw/hqdefault.jpg)
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: SamB on 03 June, 2013, 19:15:50
Recently I've been focussing on getting my kendama more accurate, particularly the Speed Trick B. Seems it paid off with a new PB of 44 seconds!
http://youtu.be/SWj-xVTSXd8 (http://youtu.be/SWj-xVTSXd8)
Also, I used the PLAY kendama I won at the BKO. I have to say it has broken in nicely!
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: The Void on 11 June, 2013, 13:11:28
Awesome work Sam. Keep it up for HyperJapan/EKO!
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: the milky oolong on 27 January, 2015, 20:32:07
Thought I'd revive this thread as a) I'm currently going through my paces shaving off the seconds, and b), well, it might be an important practise point for a lot of other players.

After hardly touching it up until last year's EKO (where I scored a not so great 2m16s) it's become one of my essential practise lines, and I've learned a lot from it. As soon as there's a mention of time pressure or real rep at stake I'm a seriously nervous kendama player, but just practising Speed Trick B alone has helped me with my breathing, focus and steadiness of hand.

It's only after grappling with it almost every day that you realize that it's a ladder that's been very carefully thought out: after the Candle, it's 22 Cup to Spike stations, with the x2 Around the World punishing the careless with a repeated 8 before moving on. Then, after all this Cups and Spike stuff, the Bird > In demands a totally different kind of play, and requires you to switch into it smoothly.

The moment that 'In' hits home it's all about perfect releases and smooth arcs and flips in what seems like the slalom run of the trick. Then, just when you're keen on your toes for flips you're jerked back down a gear with the Lighthouse > Falling Down, an 'about face' of style that requires a great deal of concentration for such a seemingly easy finishing trick.

Anyone have any thoughts on this elegant little run? Feel like I'd benefit from any cheeky hints.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: The Void on 02 February, 2015, 18:59:14
Today I ran STB 5 seconds too slowly. Not for any grading, just for noticing that my porridge was bubbling over the bowl in the microwave.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: The Void on 10 February, 2015, 12:26:07
Dusted off the ol' STB last night. Got a 45 sec run, including 2 misses on Bird. That'll do.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: azleonhart on 16 March, 2015, 08:15:59
Anyone have any thoughts on this elegant little run? Feel like I'd benefit from any cheeky hints.


Hmm.. When i started out with STB i simply did all the tricks in order without time constraints, regardless of miss or not, for a few days.
Then i took my time to try to reduce the number of errors, still no time constraints for a week or so.
Then i made it so that whenever i miss a trick, i would have to start over again, but still no time constraints.
Then i tried to fit it in 120 secs, with the "miss and start over" rule.
After feeling a bit comfy, squish it to 60 secs.
And that's currently where i stand.

(Stray) observations:
- This may be the most overlooked aspect, but string length is of utmost importance. Gotta get it ideal. e.g. Too long a string can add 1 or 2 secs to the pull-up candlestick, or even earth turn.
- String tension is also crucial. Tangled string can punish you anywhere between 2-7 seconds.
- The more time your tama / ken is spent in the air, the more time you'll lose.
- For Around Japan / World / Europe, i highly recommend starting from the small cup. The progression is more natural (in a circle), thus faster.
- Transitioning between tricks is an art, it seems. At places where your playing hand switches between the tama and ken, especially after the 1st and 7th trick, time can be lost fiddling with strings, ken, etc. Experiment the fastest ways to transition out.
- Just before the tama touches the sarado (during a spike), i quickly "bounce" the tama out to gain some microseconds.
- The same can also be done with the last trick. It's basically a lighthouse insta-spike kinda thing.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: shalafi on 16 March, 2015, 09:21:00
I am between phase 2 and 3 of azleonhart. Some days I try to do it without misses, some days I try to squeeze it under 2 minutes.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: The Void on 16 March, 2015, 10:28:08
(Stray) observations:
- This may be the most overlooked aspect, but string length is of utmost importance. Gotta get it ideal. e.g. Too long a string can add 1 or 2 secs to the pull-up candlestick, or even earth turn.
I think you are overestimating, by a large margin. And anyway, whatever you have decided is your optimum string length for general play is probably the best length for STB too.
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- String tension is also crucial. Tangled string can punish you anywhere between 2-7 seconds.
True, but... Obvious? Don't start with a twisted string.
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- The more time your tama / ken is spent in the air, the more time you'll lose.
True.
Quote
- For Around Japan / World / Europe, i highly recommend starting from the small cup. The progression is more natural (in a circle), thus faster.
True
Quote
- Transitioning between tricks is an art, it seems. At places where your playing hand switches between the tama and ken, especially after the 1st and 7th trick, time can be lost fiddling with strings, ken, etc. Experiment the fastest ways to transition out.
Yes!
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- Just before the tama touches the sarado (during a spike), i quickly "bounce" the tama out to gain some microseconds.
Hmmm. Well, "just after", not "just before". Maybe. Or "have the other hand ready to remove the tama instantly" - that's what I see the top Japanese players doing.
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- The same can also be done with the last trick. It's basically a lighthouse insta-spike kinda thing.
Well, there's a huge trade-off between speed and control there. I'd rather take 1-2 seconds to get a controlled drop, rather than making a wild one and hoping it's good, and that I don't have to start from the LH again.

Ultimately, I think azleonhart has taken the approach of "considering the factors of each individual element of STB", which is the smart thing to do. There are fractions of seconds to be saved in many places. Think about ALL of your movements.

Plus "try not to miss". :)
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: shalafi on 16 March, 2015, 11:34:54
With my current skill level, I find much more efficient to take each trick calmly and go for "try not to miss" than trying to speed up.

Specially with the falling down and the bird, I am not comfortable with the insta style. It makes sense when trying to save seconds, but if you do it calmly, you can get it under 1:45 if there are few misses.

Transitions, instead, is a place where I am already saving seconds. They are independent of the trick per-se.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: azleonhart on 18 April, 2015, 05:02:08
Here's Kubota Tamotsu's STB i recorded during his time in Malaysia.
Just one take needed. ONE TAKE!

Kubota Tamotsu - Speed Trick B (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_dMbUDor_Y#)



Even with the extra Around Japan, he still nails it within 30s.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: The Void on 18 April, 2015, 11:48:25
Solid! :)
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: azleonhart on 18 April, 2015, 13:07:23
Solid! :)

@The Void still in Tokyo? It's sad that i won't get to meet you at KWC.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: The Void on 01 September, 2015, 14:00:47
My fastest run on video. (Possibly my fastest ever - but I may have done 35 or 34 - I can't quite remember).
http://juggling.tv/15355
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: shalafi on 01 September, 2015, 15:39:08
Nice one @The Void anything under 40 is impressive.
Title: Re: Speed Trick B
Post by: The Void on 22 June, 2017, 19:13:59
Had a quick blast at #speedtrickb tonight. About 38s. Not my fastest, but pretty good with all this rust everywhere.
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